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Length: 5:12
ANDERSON COOPER: The vote
today in the Senate was close, 50-48. And the debate
leading up to it was fierce.
As the Senate debated, the bloodshed continues in
Iraq, of course. At least 70 people died in attacks
today across the country.
CNN's Michael Ware has been on the ground in Iraq
since the war began. He joins me now from Baghdad.
Michael, earlier today, Republican Senator John
McCain told Wolf Blitzer that the new strategy is
working in Iraq, and, in some parts of Baghdad
outside the Green Zone, Americans can walk around.
I want to play you part of what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "THE SITUATION ROOM")
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I know for a fact that
much of the success we're experiencing, including the
ability of Americans in many parts -- not all. we
have got a long, long way to go. we've only got two
of the five brigades there -- to go into some
neighborhoods in Baghdad in a secure fashion.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Is that true? You're on the ground there.
MICHAEL WARE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely not,
Anderson.
Actually, the senator couldn't be further from the
truth. I mean, the senator has been very solid on his
Iraq strategy to this point. He's always been very
cautious and very conservative when it comes to Iraq,
warning people, despite the unpopularity, that the
war needs more troops, not less, that we will have to
stay longer, not shorter.
Yet, here, he's just gone way out on a limb. To
suggest that out there, right now, are any streets
where Americans could walk, without a Shia militia
being tipped off, without a Sunni insurgency scooping
you up, without al Qaeda snatching you, or without
local gangs just seeing dollar signs and taking
you away, is ludicrous.
If he knows any part of this city where Americans can
walk, then I'd appreciate the senator coming and
telling me that, and we'll go and take that walk
together.
He even suggested General Petraeus, the commander of
all forces here, travels out almost daily without
arms. Well, the American officers we spoke to were
laughing about this. The general travels in a heavy,
very well protected, multilayered bubble of security.
So, Senator McCain is way off base -- Anderson.
COOPER: But he's saying that two of the five U.S.
brigades can travel in neighborhoods in a secure
fashion. I mean, I guess that's open to
interpretation what that means exactly, in a secure
fashion.
What is your read on it?
WARE: Well, yes, there's two out of five of the U.S.
brigades being sent for this surge operation are --
have arrived. The third is now in the process of
arriving.
And, yes, where we can now send in thousands of
troops throughout Baghdad and have them swirling
about the city, it was very hard for them to do this
before. Now they're actually staying in these
neighborhoods. The direct result of that is that a
particular type of violence is now down by as much as
a quarter. That's sectarian violence.
Now, one of the big reasons for that is that the
death squads and their facilitators are actually the
police and the army forces themselves that the U.S.
forces are with each and every night. So the death
squads are being kept off the streets almost
literally.
But at the same time, we're seeing violence displaced
elsewhere, north of the city, further away from the
city. So that brigades can move through the city is
nothing new, nor is that revelatory, nor does that
really tell us what Senator McCain would like us to
believe it says.
COOPER: The Iraqi government says that the number of
civilians killed in the capital was down by more than
80 percent. They say the number of kidnappings down
by almost 90 percent, and a third fewer roadside
bombs and car bombings. Do you buy that?
WARE: Yes, I do. I think a lot of those figures can
be correct. Whether they're to those degrees, it's
hard to say.
So far, the military is playing it very close to
their chest. Here on the ground, they send a much,
much more restrained message. They're saying,
"There's lots of good initial indications, but we
believe it's far too early to tell yet."
I mean, one of the big things that commanders say to
us is that, "We know that many of the Shia militias
are laying low, that the Sunni insurgents in Baghdad
are doing what we -- they do every time we have a
major offensive." They're laying low, or they have
moved outside, such as to the province of Diyala,
north of the capital, where violence has picked up so
much since the surge began that General Petraeus has
been forced to send a battalion of Strykers to that
troubled province.
So, it's very hard to tell what's going on at this
stage or to read too much into it long term --
Anderson.
COOPER: So, just to be clear, Michael, I mean, you
have been covering this war since 2003. You don't
live in the Green Zone. You live in a location
outside the Green Zone.
Is there any place in Baghdad that you would go by
yourself without security, and stay for more than,
say, 10 or 15 minutes in one spot on the street?
WARE: No. I'm afraid to say there isn't.
It's very difficult moving about this city now at the
best of times. Westerners have to move in very
well-protected ways. It's hard to move unnoticed. No
one would miss you on the streets. They'd spot you
immediately. And the attention that you would attract
on these streets would be fatal.
COOPER: Michael Ware, appreciate it. You have taken a
lot of risks over the years. Appreciate it, Michael.
Thanks.